12 March 2011

Deciding the Ground Rules

Chris wrote back to my proposal in this post as follows:
Starting this morning, I'm going to redirect the conversations on FB and Twitter. I will disengage with what few stragglers that are left of Ingrid's supporters on my FB Wall and not engage any new ones that might show up. That will settle things down on my social media.

I will also hold of on publishing the blog post that I have ready.

Aside from that I cannot offer anything more at this point.
That seems reasonable, Chris. I'll do the same.



I'm assuming that means we're trying my offer out. Thank you for that. I said "We can talk about what the process would look like, etc. if you're interested," so that's what I wanted to cover now. I hope we can hammer that out pretty fast (I don't want to waste time arguing about the shape of the table we're at, but if the point is clarity and understanding, setting expectations and methodology at the outset seems prudent).

Goal

I suggest as an initial step that we isolate and explore the concept of bridger. Put another way:

  • I claim you haven't understood the real meaning of the term, so your critiques have been ill-aimed
  • You claim the term is inherently fallacious, so using it demonstrates poor discernment

In both cases, the term's definition is central, so I propose a goal of getting to the point where we agree that both of us understand what the "bridger" concept meant to include, as it was originally used. (I know it's a little dangerous to put it that way, because I'm not speaking for Ingrid, and she proposed it. I will be defending my understanding, based on what was written and what I've heard from Ingrid on the radio and on the phone. I believe I've got it right, but I'll grant Ingrid could disagree in the future, especially on any extended applications.)

In scope would be what's already been written, so long as it can be defended as relevant to the goal.

The following discussions/charges would be out of scope:

  • Whether Ingrid (or others) have applied the term to people wrongly
  • Whether the term itself is reasonable and worth using
  • Any comments on the way you (or others) have criticized the term or those who have used it

(I'm not saying these things aren't important or unrelated. I'm just trying to minimize scope to a useful, manageable starting point.)

If we get to the goal, we can talk about a next step, if one makes sense. At a minimum, even if no other step could be taken, I believe understanding on this point would give valuable context to everything else that's been said.

Process

I believe these two characteristics are mandatory in our discussion, to keep to the spirit of the offer:

  1. It must be limited. That means just the two of us, without comments from the peanut gallery.
  2. It must be public. The content needs to be available for anyone, to ensure transparency and accountability moving forward.

My thinking is that however we do this, we would be the only ones participating in that arena during the discussion. If other people post stuff elsewhere commenting, we wouldn't encourage it or participate there, but we can't prohibit it; commenting in other places is their prerogative. I'm also not insisting you lock yourself in an isolation booth; I'm guessing we'll both get private side comments from people. Considering those may be part of thinking through things. I'm just saying we are the only ones talking and we're totally responsible for setting the context of the discussion.

Location

I'm flexible. Generally, I'd prefer written communication; with the limited scope of the initial goal, that doesn't seem to be a huge burden, though we'll want to be careful to stay on topic and not shotgun a bunch of points in at one time. We could put it on my blog; I'd only approve comments from you. If you have a different location you think would work and still satisfy the process characteristics I've listed, let me know.

If you'd rather talk over the phone or Skype, that could probably be done for at least part of it. I'd want to record anything and make that part of the record; if it's not hours long, I could probably get a transcript made. I think some sort of written conclusion (giving the final state relative to the goal) is needed, to be given by the two of us (at the same time, if not jointly). I'd want your agreement on that at the start.

What's next?

We need to decide on a forum, unless you're okay with using my blog, and I'd like you to agree to the scope and goal, the two mandatory characteristics, and the written conclusion, all listed above. If you have questions or points of clarification, let me know.

IMO, once that's pounded out, we'll have set up the ground rules and can get started. I have a starting point in mind, but I'm open to any ideas you have.

I'll post this separately on my blog as part of the process and wait to hear from you.

3 comments:

  1. On Mar 12, 2011, at 13:45, Chris Rosebrough wrote:

    My apologies. Tried to have private exchange with [NAME DELETED] but didn't it didn't stay private. Please forgive me. I screwed up.

    Thanks for letting me know. You're forgiven.

    I'll wait to hear back from you on the rest.

    ReplyDelete
  2. On Mar 12, 2011, at 14:05, Chris Rosebrough wrote:

    I like your idea. Maybe what we could do is post our exchange on both of our blogs simultaneously. And I don't think we should allow comments.

    It should really take the form of a formal debate that people can watch but not interject. We should agree on an outline that includes word limits as well as structures the discussion into Opening Statements, Clarifying questions being asked of each other (cross examination) and closing statements.


    Simultaneous blog posting with no comments allowed works fine for me. Putting word count limits and some sort of structure in place also makes sense; it's easy for online discussions to collapse under their own weight.

    I don't like trying to structure this current dialogue as a formal debate, however. I'll grant that we may have a difference of opinion that could work like that, given the right resolution, and I'm open to doing that sometime. But while that might edify the Body by fleshing out the bigger questions, it won't do anything to heal the wounds of the people whose relationships have been damaged by what's happened the past few weeks and months. That's a greater burden for me right now, and a formal debate seems unlikely to have a positive effect there.

    I suggested the initial topic I did because I think that a misunderstanding there drove much of what's followed. My aim was to talk through the issues, improving understanding and gaining clarity on where the dispute started, then why, if, and how that focus changed over time.

    I'm going to suggest a structure/word count based on my original suggestion of topic ("Define 'bridger' giving the meaning and scope intended in its original use"), just to keep things moving there. It's not quite like a formal, with the cross-ex, etc. but I think it might get to the goal cleanly.

    1. Statement giving an answer to the question (500 words)
    2. Response indicating areas of agreement and difference (500 words)
    3. Clarifying or challenging question to maker of original statement (150 words)
    4. Answer to question (300 words)
    5. Repeat 3-4 up to five times (at discretion of questioner)
    6. Final summary by questioner (500 words)
    7. Statement by original speaker giving revised answer to the question (500 words)

    Then repeat, switching roles. After that, we can write a final statement (either in parallel or jointly, depending on the result of the discussion) of 250 words each.

    I've never done something like this, so if the word counts wind up being seriously nutty, that's open for change even after starting, IMO. I can get wordy, so I'm erring on the side of brevity.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Chris has replied. Since his reply has formatting that can't be put in comments on BlogSpot, I've made a separate post here.

    ReplyDelete

You can use basic HTML markup (e.g. <b>, <i>).

Note: Commenting is a privilege not a right. Please see the policy on comments if you have further questions.